No problem! In fact, I know one of the rangers who served in the battle. Great guy! Sparred with him last night, actually... don't really remember doing it...

Welcome!

I have seen neither BHD nor SPR. For all the war movies I have seen, We Were Soldiers stands above the rest for me for two reasons: A) beyond the actual action screenplay, the authenticity makes Vietnam vets I've known break down and cry like few others have, at least, according to them; and B) the wives/women were represented as part of the war effort in a way that has not been done otherwise, that I have (reiterating, of course, my concession that I haven't seen every war movie ever made). The price the wives/women played, the roles they played, are too often an afterthought, but WWS addressed it, and did so quite well.

I will admit, if a movie appears to be jingoist or war-glorifying propaganda, I form a preconceived notion of it and avoid - so, BHD, American Sniper, Pearl Harbor are just a few movies I won't see, unless I'm told that they're not just propaganda. Films like Apocalypse Now, Hamburger Hill, Born on the Fourth of July, and Casualties of War, also stand out for me as good films.

@DRDMovieMusings said:

Welcome!

I have seen neither BHD nor SPR. For all the war movies I have seen, We Were Soldiers stands above the rest for me for two reasons: A) beyond the actual action screenplay, the authenticity makes Vietnam vets I've known break down and cry like few others have, at least, according to them; and B) the wives/women were represented as part of the war effort in a way that has not been done otherwise, that I have (reiterating, of course, my concession that I haven't seen every war movie ever made). The price the wives/women played, the roles they played, are too often an afterthought, but WWS addressed it, and did so quite well.

I will admit, if a movie appears to be jingoist or war-glorifying propaganda, I form a preconceived notion of it and avoid - so, BHD, American Sniper, Pearl Harbor are just a few movies I won't see, unless I'm told that they're not just propaganda. Films like Apocalypse Now, Hamburger Hill, Born on the Fourth of July, and Casualties of War, also stand out for me as good films.

I dont find BHD or SPR war glorifying propaganda, can you extend on it why you think they are? What about Letters from Iwo Jima?

@Markoff said:

@DRDMovieMusings said:

Welcome!

I have seen neither BHD nor SPR. For all the war movies I have seen, We Were Soldiers stands above the rest for me for two reasons: A) beyond the actual action screenplay, the authenticity makes Vietnam vets I've known break down and cry like few others have, at least, according to them; and B) the wives/women were represented as part of the war effort in a way that has not been done otherwise, that I have (reiterating, of course, my concession that I haven't seen every war movie ever made). The price the wives/women played, the roles they played, are too often an afterthought, but WWS addressed it, and did so quite well.

I will admit, if a movie appears to be jingoist or war-glorifying propaganda, I form a preconceived notion of it and avoid - so, BHD, American Sniper, Pearl Harbor are just a few movies I won't see, unless I'm told that they're not just propaganda. Films like Apocalypse Now, Hamburger Hill, Born on the Fourth of July, and Casualties of War, also stand out for me as good films.

I dont find BHD or SPR war glorifying propaganda, can you extend on it why you think they are? What about Letters from Iwo Jima?

I can't expand on it, I admit that my preconception may be irrational, regarding these movies specifically. But, generally, USA spends such an inordinate amount of money on military (more than the next five or ten countries combined? What in the world, literally, are they defending against if no country has anywhere near the military potential to mount any legitimate threat?) it just gets tiring to live in the shadow (as a Canadian) of the war-mongering, militaristic cultural mindset, and America's own irrational love of guns, militarized police, etc. Australia had gun crime problems, they enacted sufficient restrictions to eliminate mass shootings, something that proliferates across the USA at mind-numbing frequency while they determine to argue that similar could not be effective States-side.

And, I'd never before even heard of Letters from Iwo Jima.

At any rate, maybe, out of this convo, I have three movies to add to my "watch list" :-)

I would say that vets of BHD actually like having the movie around just to get their story out there. I don't think it glorifies anything, but instead shows the horrors of war. The ranger vet I know who served there said the movie was pretty good, but more importantly, got his story out there at a time when no one had heard of it or of what they did.

Thanks to @mav100000 for the post, and to all who fielded my comments - I've learned something and will check out these movies :-)

America's obsession with guns is her obsession to remain a dominant force based upon the ideology of those who believe there is no other greater right than to bear arms. Nevermind the consequences...they don't even factor into the equation.

Some men with great power and influence get a hard on for war. There are enough examples throughout history of such men.

Wasn't Letters from Iwojima a Clint Eastwood production? I've never seen it, but heard it was well done and we'll received.

Gotta say, Nubyan, I know a bunch of gun owners and none of them fit your description. Talk to some of the pro-gun people. Most are ok, some are crazy. But most are good people. I don't personally own one, but plan to one day (despite already being in my 30s) and I don't think I am propping up any ideology.

@mav100000 said:

Gotta say, Nubyan, I know a bunch of gun owners and none of them fit your description. Talk to some of the pro-gun people. Most are ok, some are crazy. But most are good people. I don't personally own one, but plan to one day (despite already being in my 30s) and I don't think I am propping up any ideology.

I really wasn't speaking about individual gun owners. My comment was more about governments and those who are in power wanting to remain the super power of the world and having dominance over all. As a country, America is first on the list with two other countries vying for the same.

I don't have a problem with responsible individual gun owners. I too don't own, but have members of my family that do for professional and/or personal reasons.

The discussion is about war movies which is what prompted my comment. Sorry if I wasn't clear or misleading. It wasn't my intent.

@DRDMovieMusings said:

@Markoff said:

@DRDMovieMusings said:

Welcome!

I have seen neither BHD nor SPR. For all the war movies I have seen, We Were Soldiers stands above the rest for me for two reasons: A) beyond the actual action screenplay, the authenticity makes Vietnam vets I've known break down and cry like few others have, at least, according to them; and B) the wives/women were represented as part of the war effort in a way that has not been done otherwise, that I have (reiterating, of course, my concession that I haven't seen every war movie ever made). The price the wives/women played, the roles they played, are too often an afterthought, but WWS addressed it, and did so quite well.

I will admit, if a movie appears to be jingoist or war-glorifying propaganda, I form a preconceived notion of it and avoid - so, BHD, American Sniper, Pearl Harbor are just a few movies I won't see, unless I'm told that they're not just propaganda. Films like Apocalypse Now, Hamburger Hill, Born on the Fourth of July, and Casualties of War, also stand out for me as good films.

I dont find BHD or SPR war glorifying propaganda, can you extend on it why you think they are? What about Letters from Iwo Jima?

I can't expand on it, I admit that my preconception may be irrational, regarding these movies specifically. But, generally, USA spends such an inordinate amount of money on military (more than the next five or ten countries combined? What in the world, literally, are they defending against if no country has anywhere near the military potential to mount any legitimate threat?) it just gets tiring to live in the shadow (as a Canadian) of the war-mongering, militaristic cultural mindset, and America's own irrational love of guns, militarized police, etc. Australia had gun crime problems, they enacted sufficient restrictions to eliminate mass shootings, something that proliferates across the USA at mind-numbing frequency while they determine to argue that similar could not be effective States-side.

And, I'd never before even heard of Letters from Iwo Jima.

At any rate, maybe, out of this convo, I have three movies to add to my "watch list" :-)

OK, I could understand this sentiment and in this respect BHD is really about unnecessary intervention, but I hope nobody consider SPR or LfIJ war mongering movies, it's not like you could just ignore WW2. I find actually LfIJ very balanced movie and it was very touching and have good memories of it, though there are two parts, I think I prefered the one from the point of Japanese. Opening scene of SPR is just stunning to show horrors of war, I remember I was blown away when I saw the movie in cinema and it had on me similar effect to Schindler's list, so I would not say it's war glorifying propaganda. Not sure about American Sniper, can't remember much, found it pretty boring, I can recommend European (Dannish?) A war, though it's siding with military so maybe not to your liking. I don't like dumb movies showing American hero soldier beating up ass of everyone else without realistic portrayal of enemy. I would recommend starting with Letters from Iwo Jima which is quite balanced from unusual perspective, SPR is already quite mainstream flick and BHD is nice action movie, don't expect much depth except forced poetic blabbering of main character which sounds like parody of Sheen from Platoon (though I found already that a cliche, rich idealistic boy experiencing voluntarily war, yeah sure...).

I am European btw.

@Markoff Cool!

No problem. I'm almost positive that did happen, just not in the movie. Re-watching the movie over the next day or two, actually, and I always enjoy it, but also always think now about what a vet of the battle I met said: the film doesn't accurately portray how much fire was incoming at any time. The movie, intense as it is, downplayed how much incoming they were taking at any time.

@mav100000 said:

No problem. I'm almost positive that did happen, just not in the movie. Re-watching the movie over the next day or two, actually, and I always enjoy it, but also always think now about what a vet of the battle I met said: the film doesn't accurately portray how much fire was incoming at any time. The movie, intense as it is, downplayed how much incoming they were taking at any time.

Incredible!