@mechajutaro said:

Look, you're hateful and combative. You only pick on me on this board, no one gets my back about it, and it's exhausting. This doesn't even have that much to do with cinema. If you don't stop antagonizing me, I will put your *** back on ignore. Is that clear?

I was only kidding, 'Loid. And the comment which you're referring to("That's a shame that those light skinned students didn't have the intellectual wherewithal to prevent this from being the horror you describe, 'Loid. Namely, they could have replied with words to the effect of "I've made my peace with my light skinned heritage, with the help of my ancestral memories. The most lucid of which is my white great grandfather bending your great grandmother over a pool table, and ensuring that I'd be here to have this chat with you today")wasn't a swipe at you. That was aimed at the sort of uni professor you were describing, who challenged his light skinned students to "defend their heritage" in front of the rest of the class

That wasn't the only comment I was referring to. Now, I imagine that there will be people reading who thought, hmm. How anti-social and pro-censorship of that guy for doing what I did. Well, I don't like having my ancestors talked about badly, period. Furthermore, mech is a tiresome person. It's taxing doing this day after day, writing nice, well-articulated posts on here (with a Kindle, no less).

@mechajutaro said:

Black girl telling a Latina she's "just" a Puerto Rican

It would seem that this isn't a belief held by black men when it comes to Latinas, at least not all of them. We know this because Spike himself clearly didn't view Rosie Perez as just another woman on the set of "Do The Right Thing." He admired her face and form so much, he was compelled to get her out of her clothes, the rub ice all over her body, all while filming the entire affair

Oh yeah, I still really dig the lighting technique in the scene you described, to this day... you can see the shadows of a moving fan in the room... so cool. I heard that they didn't shoot Rosie Perez's face in those shots because she cried about being photographed while nude. She says she doesn't see a big deal about it today.

@mechajutaro said:

Oh yeah, I still really dig the lighting technique in the scene you described to this day... you can see the shadows of a moving fan in the room... so cool.

You needn't pretend that the lighting technique was what you enjoyed about that scene, 'Loid

Haha, Nah, but I haven't seen it in any other film from before or since.

[@mechajutaro] said:

I reflect upon the words of Frances Cress Welsing in her book, The Isis Papers, on what she thought racism to be. May she rest in peace. She was a sort of melanin worshipper, which I am not in favor of. However, she seemed to give a f about her people, and she had her own interesting way of looking at the issues. Take a look at the book sometime....

If by "interesting" you mean "bats-it insane, even in comparison to the bubble headed babblings of today's Woke Warriors", then yeah, Welsing fits this bill more snuggly than Big Joe in the prison shower's personal parts fit into the bunghole of the seventeen year old prison fish who's turn it is to be broken in. When one skims over her "thinking" , it's tough to not then wonder how seriously we should take her thoughts on even the weather, much less the factors which contribute to some portions of our civilization having a tougher time socioeconomically than do others

Whenever I start wondering why conditions in certain places in the U.S. are SO adverse

All levity aside, 'Loid, you really think that such circumstances are mostly the fault of racism towards black people, and aren't in large part attributable to a drug war which has had in the effect of actually fueling the drug trade in our nation's most distressed enclaves, or current anti-poverty policies which actually serve to keep people poor? We can argue about the degree to which some of these policies were crafted by folks who had racist beliefs, nonetheless it's quite a jump to say that such things=society "waging war" on blacks/non-whites more broadly. Especially when one recognizes that The Drug War and failed anti-poverty policies have also been having a devastating effect on predominantly white communities like Appalachia for some time now

Back to politics: I’m not invested in Welsing’s proposed origin of white folks… stuff like that is for the birds, to use a cliche. I am interested in solving the problem of racism, for once and for all. Welsing provided a different outlook on the problem, however theoretical it may be.

I agree with her statement in Isis Papers where she says that White Supremacy is war in general, and more specifically, war on black men… just to clarify myself.

@mechajutaro said:

How would we go about ridding the human race of all racial prejudice and bias, 'Loid? I don't deny the importance of calling these things out, when damning evidence exists of such things. Talking here Juan Williams's book on Donald Trump, or Tony Camerino calling out the degree to which racial prejudice shaped US counter-terrorism policy post 9/11. Lately though, we've conflated writing op-eds and putting you YouTube videos political action like fighting to end a drug war which overwhelmingly locks up black and Hispanic people, especially men within these two demographics. Or having a serious, tooth and nail fight to curb The White House's power to launch military adventures without the approval of Congress. That right there might have prevented the debacle in Iraq

This part of your post could use an edit, methinks.

It is a unique and idiosyncratic outlook, I agree, 'Loid. It's also one which has little to no basis in empirical evidence

I was sort of getting at that in my post.

I agree with her statement in Isis Papers where she says that White Supremacy is war in general, and more specifically, war on black men… just to clarify myself.

We can have an entirely separate conversation on the increasingly vague and elastic definition of White Supremacy. Allegations that there is a war on black men in modern day America require data in support of them

Secret wars don’t have a bunch of data floating around about them.

@mechajutaro said:

@CelluloidFan said:

I wanted to write about the idea of 'the end of the innocence' as a black person, using a scene in Spike Lee's Crooklyn.

This is a concept I've heard of before, inc. in a song by Don Henley, I think. I'll be brief.

As a child growing up in post-race riots Detroit, rest assured, all I knew was: I am black.

In time, other black people made me see that I was different or, to some, of a certain complexion, as a former cohort pointed out.

I saw this experience reflected as a sort of screen memory in Crooklyn, in the scene wherein a little black girl tells a little Puerto Rican girl that she's "just a Puerto Rican," IIRC, putting her down.

Yes, my experience was - at least to some - within the race, but the message was similar.

Get it? They showed me that I was different. I learned it from other black folks.

That was "the end of the innocence" for me, in terms of being a black person.

Tough as it is to be non-white in The US sometimes, it's only when we go overseas and return with unrequested souvenirs 11:40-12:40 (freeze frame on 12:40) that we start to be grateful for what we have here, warts and all

It’s a personal post, mechajutaro… I do hope that’s still allowed here.

The point of my original post has little to do with black privilege, as far as I'm concerned. I simply related my feeling that I didn't see myself the same way after being told by other black people that I was different. Hence, my use of the Don Henley song title

@mechajutaro said:

The point of my original post has little to do with black privilege, as far as I'm concerned. I simply related my feeling that I didn't see myself the same way after being told by other black people that I was different.

Wasn't this obvious to you by the age of 5, when you looked into the mirror and realized that your complexion was darker, and you're hair curlier than that of blonde Becky, the waitress at Denny's ? Asking because this was the age that I realized that I looked more Near Eastern and Hispanic than I did Anglo

I knew I was different from white folks, but didn't feel I was (that) different from other black folks... for some reason. In case you didn't notice, that was the departure point for the thread.

You know, on second thought, that is a sign of privilege....

@mechajutaro said:

@CelluloidFan said:

@mechajutaro said:

The point of my original post has little to do with black privilege, as far as I'm concerned. I simply related my feeling that I didn't see myself the same way after being told by other black people that I was different.

Wasn't this obvious to you by the age of 5, when you looked into the mirror and realized that your complexion was darker, and you're hair curlier than that of blonde Becky, the waitress at Denny's ? Asking because this was the age that I realized that I looked more Near Eastern and Hispanic than I did Anglo

I knew I was different from white folks, but didn't feel I was (that) different from other black folks... for some reason. In case you didn't notice, that was the departure point for the thread.

You know, on second thought, that is a sign of privilege....

That gal who was told she was just a Puerto Rican may very well have beauty privilege, if she looks anything like this , and has the dexterity to go along with it

The thing about perceived beauty privilege is: Some people will go out of their way to dog you if they feel you have it. I’m reminded of an African-American deejay, who is somewhat popular, who used to rail against black guys who have a certain hair consistency on the air— or, more accurately, the women who fancy them for it.