I'm watching it and loving it bratface. The production values and leading actors, particularly the inscrutable Japanese lord Toranaga (Hiroyuki Sanada) and the less cunning Yabushige (Tadanobu Asano), are excellent. And while I love his Richard Burton-sounding voice, it took me a while to warm up to the way Anjin (Cosmos Jarvis) is portrayed, as I saw the original version way back when and don't recall Richard Chamberlin's portrayal as being so contentious, crude and sarcastic. I may be wrong. Or maybe the role was written to be a bit more sympathetic for the "King of the Miniseries". I should probably re-watch the original sometime, but it'll be hard to settle for the TV production values of 40 years ago (just like with Poldark). Mariko/Anna Sawai in the new version seems more beautiful than Lady Toda in the earlier version but it could be argued no one, male or female, compares to the beauty of Richard Chamberlin. My mother, may she rest in peace, absolutely worshiped him!

Just getting to it. One hell of a first episode! Nudity. Guy boiled alive. Sword beheadings! Hot actors!

@felixxx999 said:

beheadings!

I haven't seen this one, and I must've been barely a toddler when the original mini came on tv/reruns. But I remember the beheading scene in that one. Freaked me out pretty bad, definitely the most violent thing I saw on 80s tv. Sounds like they've turned it up a few notches for this one. Hide your kids...

It's definitely more gory than the original, no doubt since viewers have become enured to extreme violence. Wait until you see the cannon scene. Yowza.

I have tried to watch this version, mainly because I like Hiroyuki Sanada (Toranaga) but I just can't get used to Jarvis (he creeps me out).

I just can't get used to Jarvis (he creeps me out).

I actually think it HELPS this version that Cosmo Jarvis isn't the "matinee idol" Richard Chamberlain was. Jarvis' brawn and roughness make him more plausible as a seaman. And there seem to be many more prominent Japanese commanding our attention rather than the focus on the romance between Blackthorne and Mariko. IIRC in the original, the Portuguese seemed to have much more of a presence, although maybe they'll be a greater factor in the last half of this series.

The situation is quite interesting, although I find the show disappointing and less entertaining than I hoped. For some reason the show writers have chosen to focus on romance and personal drama, instead of the world building, political intrigues and battles. The start was somewhat promising, but now at mid-season the plot is very weak and mostly about completely irrelevant issues. I understand the need to show the difference between the Western and the Japanese cultures, but the ways the writers decided to do that are dumb and too simplistic, very stereotypical. Too much babbling, too much dumb poetry, too much silly melodrama. Don't know if this is how it is in the book, but the show is just boring.

@D-magic said:

The situation is quite interesting, although I find the show disappointing and less entertaining than I hoped. For some reason the show writers have chosen to focus on romance and personal drama, instead of the world building, political intrigues and battles. The start was somewhat promising, but now at mid-season the plot is very weak and mostly about completely irrelevant issues. I understand the need to show the difference between the Western and the Japanese cultures, but the ways the writers decided to do that are dumb and too simplistic, very stereotypical. Too much babbling, too much dumb poetry, too much silly melodrama. Don't know if this is how it is in the book, but the show is just boring.

I read the book way back in the late 70s & from what I remember it pretty much follows the book. Here are three articles about the 'subtle' differences.

https://time.com/6752742/shogun-miniseries-book-differences/

https://thedirect.com/article/shogun-2024-fx-series-book-differences-explained

https://www.slashfilm.com/1526171/biggest-changes-the-shogun-makes-from-the-book/

@D-magic said:

The situation is quite interesting, although I find the show disappointing and less entertaining than I hoped. For some reason the show writers have chosen to focus on romance and personal drama, instead of the world building, political intrigues and battles. The start was somewhat promising, but now at mid-season the plot is very weak and mostly about completely irrelevant issues. I understand the need to show the difference between the Western and the Japanese cultures, but the ways the writers decided to do that are dumb and too simplistic, very stereotypical. Too much babbling, too much dumb poetry, too much silly melodrama. Don't know if this is how it is in the book, but the show is just boring.

The book is certainly more detailed, intricate and captivating. Any faithful adaptation of this more than 1100 pages novel for a limited television series, including the inevitable pick-and-choose what to show and tell, is impossible. However, Justin Marks and his wife Rachel Kondo have done a remarkable job with this visually pleasing miniseries. Anyone interested in knowing more about the characters and their stories, should consider reading the novel.

I've viewed Ep. 1 through 7 so far, and as more and more of the series has aired, it seems Anjin/Blackthorne is less and less of a factor. Cosmo Jarvis is like a prop rather than a character and the show is suffering from it. I don't recall this being the case in the original, which unfortunately isn't currently unavailable for streaming. While I still enjoy the acting overall and the fine production values, the writers have made a mistake in basically jettisoning the character who was the star of the show along with Toranaga in the 1980's series. I have to admit the sense of doom and fatalism among a couple of the characters is getting tiresome. The constant treachery and intrigue would benefit from some relief now and then.

This show is amazing.

The comparisons to Game of Thrones are fair, though it's not of the same 'mean spirit' as that show for lack of a better phrase. It's a more faithful adaption of the book than the 1980s mini-series, and the performances are going to win awards (though Blackthorne falls a bit flat).

While I initially felt it was good there seemed to be increased focus on some of the Japanese characters compared to what I vaguely recalled (rightly or wrongly) of the original miniseries - e.g., I particularly enjoyed the character of Yabushige and Tadanobu Asano's outstanding performance - the writing went too far in that direction, and by diminishing Blackthorne's role ruined much of the drama. Plus, Toranaga was reduced to being a stone-faced cypher in too many of his scenes, which IMO wasted the talents of Hiroyuki Sanada. Instead of showing us his command of the campaign to become Shogun during the climax, he ends up explaining the plan passively to Yabushige near the end. And why oh why did the writers leave out Ishido's ultimate fate? Those women seemed to think his getting the letter from Lady Ochiba, breaking off their engagement, was dramatic enough. Sheesh. SMH...

Blackthorne, while ostensibly elevated in rank earlier in the series, was gradually reduced to the practical status a show dog. He was usually led along, hobbling with eyes aghast at the displays of Japanese customs, and having too little to say or do about any of it. Was that supposed to suffice in depicting a core theme of the book - a European's exposure to an entirely different culture and the ways he adapted to it - not to mention his aid in helping Toranaga's rise to Shogun? The narrative as written for this series rendered Blackthorne utterly inconsequential and stripped him of his actual status in the story. Another waste, of Cosmo Jarvis.

If this were primarily made for a Japanese audience, the overabundance of subtitles would've made more sense. But after a while I felt I was watching a foreign movie, and one which deviated too much from the tenor of the source material.

@merryapril said:

Blackthorne, while ostensibly elevated in rank earlier in the series, was gradually reduced to the practical status a show dog. He was usually led along, hobbling with eyes aghast at the displays of Japanese customs, and having too little to say or do about any of it. Was that supposed to suffice in depicting a core theme of the book - a European's exposure to an entirely different culture and the ways he adapted to it - not to mention his aid in helping Toranaga's rise to Shogun? The narrative as written for this series rendered Blackthorne utterly inconsequential and stripped him of his actual status in the story. Another waste, of Cosmo Jarvis.

Ultimately Blackthorne's goal was to colonise Japan for England, Toranaga blunted that and turned him into a distraction, a weapon against the Catholic members of the Council. He got played, as did the warlord Yabushige. Both ultimately lost their agency and were co-opted by Toranaga.

Narratively, Blackthrone represents the English and Yabushige the war lords who wanted to carve out their own niche empire in some part of Japan. This is parallels the story of the real Shogunate that the show/book is based on, because ultimately they ended up closing off Japan to the rest world (except for the port at Nagasaki) and outside influences. The English (and other European powers) ultimately never got the foothold in Japan that they did in India or China. (Notably, The Last Samurai tells the story of the end of the Shogunate and features Sanada.) By consolidating power, quashing the other power struggles and ending those internal wars, ultimately the Shogunate brought Japan together into one nation.

It is a subversion of the (for lack of a better phrase) white-savior narrative, which is I think why people think of Game of Thrones, where the characters you thought would be main protagonists get knifed. Though it's not nearly as daft.