I'll add my input in a bit. Will update this post with my feedback so check back and update the page in 20 minutes or so.

Created by -> Creator

Should only be added on the top level of the show, not as a credit.

First Assistant Art Director

Is this a common job? If it's very, very rare I think it could go as Assistant Art Director. if not rare, add to job list.

Music Supervisor ->

Music Supervisor is part of the job list!

This is a casting firm of 2 casting directors, Susan and Sharon Forrest. I can't credit the firm, but I could credit both casting directors instead. Would that be okay?

I vote yes! I see that on that other site they are listed as uncredited. We don't have that option here for crew so I'd say it should be fine.

3.2.) Two Fingers -> Main Title Theme Composed and Performed by

There is a "Theme Song Performance" credit that could be a fit. We don't have a Theme Music Composer - or perhaps Composer (Theme Music) - credit so perhaps add to job list if you like one of my suggestions or know of a better one.

3.4.) Andrea Boyd -> Executive in Charge of Production for Temple Street Productions

Executive in Charge of Production should be fine - if that is the main production company.

3.5.) Near the end of the credits ..

I'd say leave that one out at this point. It could be a possible assistant story editor position, but I'm not sure if such a credit would be correct. If I understand it correctly they were interns of some sort.

3.6.) At the end of the credits, there are specifics about the production companies with a lot of important names, personal titles etc. I don't think we have to credit those, but I drop this here and you could take a quick look if there's anything important in it at all (I don't think so)

Leave it out, would be my advice.

Could this long credit cause problems somewhere, somehow?!? I would like to keep it this long, because that's the correct form.

That is one bad-ass long credit. I would probably prefer the Various Characters approach. What do you think Banana?

Thanks for all your answers!

Created by -> Creator

Should only be added on the top level of the show, not as a credit.

Yes, of course. That was wrong in the list.

First Assistant Art Director

Is this a common job? If it's very, very rare I think it could go as Assistant Art Director. if not rare, add to job list.

It looks like a common job:

"The first, second and third assistant art directors carry out the instructions of the art director. Their work often involves measuring locations and collecting other pertinent information for the production designer. Sometimes a set designer is also the first assistant art director. In this capacity, they manage the workflow and act as the foreman of the drawing office."

I think it's better to add it to the job list and wait for the exact label.

Music Supervisor ->

Music Supervisor is part of the job list!

Yes, found it, my mistake.

This is a casting firm of 2 casting directors, Susan and Sharon Forrest. I can't credit the firm, but I could credit both casting directors instead. Would that be okay?

I vote yes! I see that on that other site they are listed as uncredited. We don't have that option here for crew so I'd say it should be fine.

Okay.

3.2.) Two Fingers -> Main Title Theme Composed and Performed by

There is a "Theme Song Performance" credit that could be a fit. We don't have a Theme Music Composer - or perhaps Composer (Theme Music) - credit so perhaps add to job list if you like one of my suggestions or know of a better one.

You mean 2 different fingers credits for this one? I can add it now under "Theme Song Performance", and I put "Theme Music Composer" (I like it) on the job list. Is it alright to credit this project under the name "Amon Tobin"?

3.4.) Andrea Boyd -> Executive in Charge of Production for Temple Street Productions

Executive in Charge of Production should be fine - if that is the main production company.

It is the main production company, but I didn't know this label exists already ...

3.5.) Near the end of the credits ..

I'd say leave that one out at this point. It could be a possible assistant story editor position, but I'm not sure if such a credit would be correct. If I understand it correctly they were interns of some sort.

They were not interns, but "experienced writers" together in some kind of workshop:

"Bell Media Prime Time TV Program: A five-month residency providing up to eight experienced writers with the opportunity to train in a simulated story department environment, guided by leading senior television creators."

"Bell Media" is the second production company of "Orphan Black", and you could say that the series started as a result of the annual workshop in 2008:

"CFC Prime Time Story Room series ORPHAN BLACK, developed by 2008 Executive Producer in Residence Graeme Manson, along with the 2008 Prime Time program residents, premieres on Saturday, March 30 on SPACE in Canada, BBC America in the States, as well as on BBC Worldwide."

But how should this be credited here on TMDb? I don't really know, and my English isn't good enough to find the exact name for it. They are some kind of co-creator, everyone a bit, I guess. But this workshop was in 2008 and the series started in 2013 - so 5 years inbetween. I'm going to read more about it; maybe I got a better idea ...

3.6.) At the end of the credits, there are specifics about the production companies with a lot of important names, personal titles etc. I don't think we have to credit those, but I drop this here and you could take a quick look if there's anything important in it at all (I don't think so)

Leave it out, would be my advice.

Yes, I think that's the best solution.

Could this long credit cause problems somewhere, somehow?!? I would like to keep it this long, because that's the correct form.

That is one bad-ass long credit. I would probably prefer the Various Characters approach. What do you think Banana?

Haha, isn't it? On the other hand, the only time you can actually see it at the moment is on Tatiana Maslany's page in her credits - if I'm not mistaken. Everywhere else it's shortened by the layout or not visible at all ...

Best wishes,

janar

"Love [...] is the most incredible gift to give and to receive as a human being." - Ellen Page

I think it's better to add it to the job list and wait for the exact label.

Agreed.

You mean 2 different fingers credits for this one? I can add it now under "Theme Song Performance", and I put "Theme Music Composer" (I like it) on the job list. Is it alright to credit this project under the name "Amon Tobin"?

I think that could work, yes, but let's wait and see what another moderator thinks. For many movies, there can be one main composer and then one who only composed the theme. So such a composer credit could be a good addition! And yes, add the real name, and artist name as an alternative. Or wait, I have actually seen it both ways. Let's wait and see what another moderator thinks before we decide.

They were not interns, but "experienced writers" together in some kind of workshop:

That means they probably did contribute quite a bit and that's why they got the credits. I'll repeat your question: But how do we credit them best here? Yeah, I'll let you think about that.

Everywhere else it's shortened by the layout or not visible at all ...

That's better, so then maybe keep it as it is. I've seen some long ones for certain animated movies and TV-series where some voice actors can get very busy.

@lineker said:

You mean 2 different fingers credits for this one? I can add it now under "Theme Song Performance", and I put "Theme Music Composer" (I like it) on the job list. Is it alright to credit this project under the name "Amon Tobin"?

I think that could work, yes, but let's wait and see what another moderator thinks. For many movies, there can be one main composer and then one who only composed the theme. So such a composer credit could be a good addition! And yes, add the real name, and artist name as an alternative. Or wait, I have actually seen it both ways. Let's wait and see what another moderator thinks before we decide.

Yes, let's wait. It's also not urgent ...

They were not interns, but "experienced writers" together in some kind of workshop:

That means they probably did contribute quite a bit and that's why they got the credits. I'll repeat your question: But how do we credit them best here? Yeah, I'll let you think about that.

So you're going to build a snowman while I have to think about this?

Everywhere else it's shortened by the layout or not visible at all ...

That's better, so then maybe keep it as it is. I've seen some long ones for certain animated movies and TV-series where some voice actors can get very busy.

Until Travis surprises us with another layout ...

Best wishes,

janar

"Love [...] is the most incredible gift to give and to receive as a human being." - Ellen Page

So you're going to build a snowman while I have to think about this?

Unfortunately spring is in the air and the sun is shining. It was more a way to imitate my own expression when I found out you would do the digging for this.

Assistant Location Manager / Music Supervisor

I'm almost positive those were added recently (or it's just my imagination.. that's also entirely possible.

3.3.) John Nelles -> Dialogue Coach /// I can't find a label for this, but the weird thing is that this credit is always the last credit in the CAST (not the CREW) on screen. So, you see all the actors/actresses, and then this dialogue coach appears always at the end as the last cast member. I don't understand why, but I could - theoretically - add him as a season regular to the cast (not the crew). I've never seen something like that before, though - and he's not an actor ... so, what to do?

Let's not add crew to cast listings, please, haha! For movies, Stunt Coordinators are often credited right after the cast list too for example. I know there's a Dialect Coach, but no Dialogue Coach. Just add it to the list.

Could this long credit cause problems somewhere, somehow?!? I would like to keep it this long, because that's the correct form.

Are those characters important? I don't think you add it to the season level as it doesn't seem to be a main character, but for guest starring, we list all characters separate, not in one line (because not every character would appear in all those episodes). Or am I misunderstanding something.

On the other points I agree with Lineker. Sometimes it's better not to add everything, if it's not really the main crew! There's often also lots of companies listed at thanks, but we're not gonna add their CEOs to thanks because of that, for example. For that stuff, I would direct everyone to go to that site that people don't want to name, they seem to have very flexible crew stuff.

And yes, add the real name, and artist name as an alternative. Or wait, I have actually seen it both ways. Let's wait and see what another moderator thinks before we decide.

Yes, real name. Band names names in alternatives. I always change it if I see it differently xD. Unless it's any individual known under an artist name, like ehh Lady Gaga. You can add that, haha. But not ehhhh, Fall Out Boy, for example. Because that's multiple peoplesssss :)

Thanks for your answers, Marr!

Assistant Location Manager / Music Supervisor

I'm almost positive those were added recently (or it's just my imagination.. that's also entirely possible.

I can find "Music Supervisor" and added it to the season 1 crew. But I think "Assistant Location Manager" is not available, yet.

3.3.) John Nelles -> Dialogue Coach [...]

Let's not add crew to cast listings, please, haha! For movies, Stunt Coordinators are often credited right after the cast list too for example. I know there's a Dialect Coach, but no Dialogue Coach. Just add it to the list.

Yes, will do.

Could this long credit cause problems somewhere, somehow?!? I would like to keep it this long, because that's the correct form.

Are those characters important? I don't think you add it to the season level as it doesn't seem to be a main character, but for guest starring, we list all characters separate, not in one line (because not every character would appear in all those episodes). Or am I misunderstanding something.

You mean we should go for importance of the specific character instead of completeness?!? Well, Tatiana Maslany plays Sarah Manning in every episode so far, and also Alison Hendrix and Cosima Niehaus with the exception of two or three episodes. Helena and Rachel Duncan are in more than 2 thirds of the episodes of all seasons -> so these 5 would be the most important. Maybe Beth Childs also, because season 1 is basically about her impersonated by Sarah -> it gets very complicated when we decide to add them based on importance.

And it just got more complicated, because another point just came to my intention: You write that "we" list all characters separately if they're guest starring. I just looked up the actor Ari Millen here on TMDb -> he plays the male clones starting with season 2. For him, there are 7 different credits regarding each of his characters in "Orphan Black"; 6 of them are treated as if he was "guest starring", while the last one is a regular credit for season 3 (he became a regular in this season). Which means, when I open a single episode, let's say, episode 3.1, the actor appears 4 times in the episode credits (1 x regular, 3 x guest star):

https://www.themoviedb.org/tv/56296-orphan-black/season/3/episode/1/cast

Theoretically, I could do the same for Tatiana Maslany's characters throughout the whole show - if that's how it should be? It would mean that she would have 12 different credits for "Orphan Black" so far, and it could be that her name would appear up to 6 or 7 times on single episodes (my estimation).

Anyway, I think those two people should be handled the same way, and right now it's different. I don't know, what's the better solution?!?

On the other points I agree with Lineker. Sometimes it's better not to add everything, if it's not really the main crew! There's often also lots of companies listed at thanks, but we're not gonna add their CEOs to thanks because of that, for example. For that stuff, I would direct everyone to go to that site that people don't want to name, they seem to have very flexible crew stuff.

Yes, I agree.

And yes, add the real name, and artist name as an alternative. Or wait, I have actually seen it both ways. Let's wait and see what another moderator thinks before we decide.

Yes, real name. Band names names in alternatives. I always change it if I see it differently xD. Unless it's any individual known under an artist name, like ehh Lady Gaga. You can add that, haha. But not ehhhh, Fall Out Boy, for example. Because that's multiple peoplesssss :)

Okay, I will add this later.

Best wishes,

janar

"Love [...] is the most incredible gift to give and to receive as a human being." - Ellen Page

I would probably prefer the Various Characters approach. What do you think Banana?

I would only credit the series regular roles as series regulars, as I initially did. We usually keep the credits on the TV side as clean/simple/spoilerless as possible. There are such things as too little and too much info. (I think some of it is in the contribution bible to be. )

I would like to keep it this long, because that's the correct form.

What's the point of having every recurring/guest starring role listed if they are not attached to their rightful episodes?

She was simply credit as "Sarah Manning" for the last four years until a user who made some questionable edits changed it to "Various Characters" a few months ago. I only added the four main ones, but we could maybe add Rachel too.

@lineker said:

So you're going to build a snowman while I have to think about this?

Unfortunately spring is in the air and the sun is shining. It was more a way to imitate my own expression when I found out you would do the digging for this.

So you turned into a snowman for a moment?!? Brrrr, that's cold ...

I did some digging: Those 9 people are all (screen/tv)writers who applied for this advanced training program in 2008, and all of them collaborately developed the idea/concept of what became "Orphan Black" 3/4 years later. They graduated from this program as "writer", but they're not involved in the actual process of writing for the show. Except for one of them, Alex Levine, it seems they're not even attached to the actual show at all - their contribution is conceptual work before the show became reality. In Alex Levine's short biography on the official CFC page it says:

Alex attended the Canadian Film Centre in 2008, where he worked under Graeme Manson developing Orphan Black (Space, BBC America) from concept to series.

If we want to credit those 9 people at all here on TMDb, I would suggest the label "co-creator" as a credit. The show is basically their brain child as a group in this specific time in 2008, and I would like to acknowledge that somehow. But I'm not sure - maybe there's better word for this in English? "Conceptual Developer"? "Series Developer"? I don't know ...

Oh, yeah, and Travis surprised us with another layout ...

Best wishes,

janar

"Love [...] is the most incredible gift to give and to receive as a human being." - Ellen Page

Sorry Banana, I missed your answer this morning - thanks for your input! You wrote:

I would probably prefer the Various Characters approach. What do you think Banana?

I would only credit the series regular roles as series regulars, as I initially did. We usually keep the credits on the TV side as clean/simple/spoilerless as possible. There are such things as too little and too much info. (I think some of it is in the contribution bible to be. )

I understand your general argument here, but there are also such things as uncomplete credits and info. In fact, I think this has nothing to do with clean/simple/spoilerless credits, here's the real problem:

What's the point of having every recurring/guest starring role listed if they are not attached to their rightful episodes?

Plain and simple, what you're saying here is that we need to make a compromise because the data base isn't built for that kind of specific data. Fine, let's find a compromise.

She was simply credit as "Sarah Manning" for the last four years until a user who made some questionable edits changed it to "Various Characters" a few months ago. I only added the four main ones, but we could maybe add Rachel too.

Well, if you ask me, the user Gabriel Almeida was correct to make this specific edit because it was wrong for 4 years to credit only "Sarah Manning". You just didn't like his compromise - so you found your own and I personally think yours is the better one (I just didn't understand we had to make a compromise). I followed the link you put under Rachel, and if you scroll up on this page, there's a nice graphic about the amount of appearances of Tatiana Maslany's characters. So, long talk -> I think I'll change her credit to:

Tatiana Maslany -> "Sarah Manning / Alison Hendrix / Cosima Niehaus / Helena / Rachel Duncan"

That's the best solution, in my opinion. Also, I'll change the credit for the actor who plays the male clones as follows:

Ari Millen -> "Mark Rollins / Rudy / Ira"

When I'm done with re-watching the next season, that is ...

Best wishes,

janar

"Love [...] is the most incredible gift to give and to receive as a human being." - Ellen Page

Plain and simple, what you're saying here is that we need to make a compromise because the data base isn't built for that kind of specific data.

I'm not going to complain, because I like compromise.

But we are build in a different way than IMDb. What you see on their main page is a compilation (i.e. every single role), but TMDb display the last season's series regulars. "Tony Zwickey" shouldn't be credited to season four, much less as a series regular. I wouldn't mind if every single role was displayed on Tatiana's profile, but I really don't know if Travis intends to improve the TV credits.

I think this has nothing to do with clean/simple

It does, though. That why I chose to only use their first names.

Sorry if I confused the issue regarding how to credit the roles. I have not seen Orphan Black (but I'm planning to at a later time) so I'm always hesitant to dig deeper (risk of seeing spoilers). I was aware of the overall story though or I wouldn't have dared looking at the topic.

You didn't!

I wonder, though, when should a "Various Characters" credit be used? It makes sense for sketch comedy series. But would you use it for movies with extra long credits (an how long is extra long)?

In my opinion... Various characters still tells me nothing 🤓 Its the same as adding the cast without name. Also tells you nothing (or Well you might assume they play just one role).

I agree it may not be so good. I was thinking for a long time about where I had seen a Various credit somewhere. Then I remembered that's how I add it for anthology movies in my own movie collection list (Google docs). So instead of adding four, six or ten directors, I just add Various. Sorry for getting off-topic.