Discuss Beauty and the Beast
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I didn't hate it [spoilers]
posted by blacknyellowsquidSTAFFMOD on March 18, 2017 at 12:45 AM
So I finally saw it. I went in with pretty low expectations. I expected it to be pretty lame, I hated the CGI in the trailers, I didn't like the way the objects looked, all that. So, for what it's worth, I liked it more than I thought I would. I was like okay, okay, I'm getting into this. I was entertained enough. Some thoughts...
I think overall the story is more believable as a cartoon. Because in live action it just seemed a lot more bizarre...and the "love story" more awkward. However, maybe it's because I'm an adult now? I just feel like you accept outrageousness in a cartoon more but except something live action to be more....realistic. And to me it made things like the bestiality undertones stand out more, and I found her falling for him less believable. But again, maybe because I'm an adult now.
Be Our Guest was the most awkward scene to me, lol. Weird pauses, I didn't understand Lumiere jumping off the table and pulling off the cloth where Belle couldn't even see him...weird camera pans from behind his back....awkward Ms Potts staring up at the screen too long. But hey haha.
As predicted before watching it, I liked LeFou the best as far as characters. They gave him the most interesting arc in my opinion, however, he was in it less than I would have wanted? Also I personally was let down by how absolutely benign the infamous "gay moment" was at the end. It looked like he just accidentally got a male dance partner, not intentional or anything romantic. They showed him dancing with the woman 100x and then it switches to a guy for a split second. It almost came across more as a joke/gag than anything else. But I like the mini-crush undertones (crushing on Gaston obvs) he had throughout the movie.
Okay Gaston. I found his character "development" to be bizarre. Besides stepping on cabbages, in my opinion, there was nothing he did in the beginning that explained why Belle found him so repulsive. I mean, compared to the rest of the town, he did seem like the most eligible bachelor, or one of the top ones. And he didn't seem like a jerk yet. So why did she hate him? I guess he was too controlling and trying to force her to like him...and then yeah as it went on he did seem like he'd be an abusive controlling boyfriend and was like suddenly evil. It was just kind of weird. In the cartoon, he's an obvious vain extreme douche jock from the get-go. Here it was like, okay he seems cool enough, besides stepping on cabbages. Oh wait he's evil. Okay? I found the Gaston thing to be confusing. I don't blame Luke Evans.
I didn't hate the CGI as much as I did in the trailers. It didn't bother me at the end of the day, for the most part.
I liked that some of the other characters seemed to have a French accent besides Lumiere...unless I was imagining things. Being that they're in France and all.
The "joke..." when Gaston is talking about Belle, he's like "She has a certain..." and LeFou is like "Je ne sais quoi?" And Gaston is like "I don't know what that means, but ok." I was like LOL okay that was a really weird like meta- or just weird joke. I get that a typical Murican or something might not know what that means, so maybe they were going for him not being savvy....but being that they're French....using an Americanized-French phrase...and then him saying he doesn't get it...I was like what lol?! Also I was thinking they probably should have been reading Molière instead of Shakespeare but shh
Found the pacing kind of odd. They dragged some scenes on too long while rushed others. eh
Found the song the Beast sings by himself after she leaves to be corny and misplaced.
I did like the background info of how the servants let the Beast turn into a spoiled jerk (as a human) like his dad, so they were responsible for the curse and how he turned out, too.
I missed the Cogsworth of the original. He was my favorite character there. He was a little more...eh...in this one. Kind of boring. And the thing with his wife at the end was annoying.
Ummmmm I think that's all I have for the moment. I enjoyed it more than I thought I would, but found some of it odd or confusing. I'd watch it again.
Reply by Phasmophobia
on March 18, 2017 at 2:14 AM
Haven't seen this yet. Did Disney change the age at which the prince is cursed? The trailer for the new movie shows a painting of him as a child instead of an adult portrait (like in the animated film).
Reply by condemned02
on March 18, 2017 at 5:03 AM
I am an adult too, and been married, divorced, been in plenty of relationships. I find how they fall inlove very realistic.
We know that Belle is not impressed by looks. The most handsome man in the Village does not touch her at all, she felt zero effects by his looks. Because she values intellectual connection the most, and the gorgeous Jock was just too dumb in the brain for her to feel even remotely any attraction to him. I mean, if she was an Aquarius especially, this is especially true for people in that horoscope. They are Sapiosexuals.
She also felt out of place in a town where nobody thinks a woman should bother educating herself at all. She felt out of place and couldn't connect with anybody.
Then she met Beast who she thought was this mean and horrible person.
Until he sacrificed his own life to save her, despite her running away.
Belle has always been a kind hearted person and generous to those she loved. She willingly sacrificed herself for her father. A lesser woman would have just gone away, left her father and cried. By this, we know the kind of calibre of woman she is. Not shallow and values things below surface values.
So it was natural after she saw what Beast did for her, she had to return the favour and make sure he is gonna be okay.
Through that, she gets to learn the more vulnerable and tender side of him.
And the way they show, how Beast knows all of her Shakespeare stuffs. In real life, if you are really into something that nobody gets. Then suddenly, someone totally gets what you are talking about. It's a very strong connection thing. You will be amazed and very interested to get to know that person better. I thought that moment was truly realistic of how people connect and the beginning of love blooming. It's what's special between both of you, that you share with nobody else.
And of course, while she came from an environment where everybody was against her being into gaining knowledge and bookish. You have Beast here who gift her the entire Library of knowledge!
She has not loved him yet but she already absolutely felt connected with him.
Until, come on, this guy let her go to her father in need without hesitation. Initially he was just a mean selfish prick of a man. He started showing with actions how much he cared for her.
And despite his Beast-like appearances. He is totally a man in thoughts and in behaviour. I don't see this as Bestiality.
How is this not realistic?
The way into a woman's heart is to understand her. She felt understood by Beast. That's why he won her affections.
Reply by lantzn
on March 18, 2017 at 5:03 AM
I haven't seen it either, but I wonder if they went with a child portrait to make it a little bit harder for Belle to recognize him. It was his adult eyes she noticed in the cartoon portrait.
Reply by lmao7
on March 18, 2017 at 5:44 AM
Yeah he's an adult when cursed and they removed the '10 years' in Be Our Guest to avoid the confusion I guess. The painting was when he was a child with his parents..for the backstory later on. The intro story of being cursed is longer in this version
Reply by tmdb38541732
on March 18, 2017 at 8:44 AM
Thanks for that very honest and elaborate review. I was upset that this movie is basically a live action remake of my all time favorite animated film. I have so many fond memories of watching the animated film Beauty and the Beast.
I'm happy to know that there are no substitutes for the original. The original is the best and it always will be. The animation was excellent especially the facial expressions. The voice acting was as well. I knew that the Cgi and acting in this live action remake was going to lower the quality of the movie. You just confirmed that for me.
So now I can watch the original just like I always have- with wonderful awe and nostalgia. I'll cry, laugh and be angry at all the parts of the film that I always have done. Sing along with the songs that I know by heart. I don't need to see stupid scenes added as a way to justify the need for a remake. I don't need to see a character who was just in awe of his best friend twisted into "gay". How was La Fou ever gay in the original? He was just a really loyal friend to Gaston. He admired the guy. Just like the members of a football team admire their star quarterback. There is nothing "gay" about that. I really am offended by the implication. This is what happens when people copy what they don't understand. This live action remake should never have been made. There is no point.
Reply by tmdb38541732
on March 18, 2017 at 9:03 AM
And the animated film depicts everything you've said so accurately and better than the live action could ever because the live action is nothing but a lower quality wannabe imitation of the original.
Reply by condemned02
on March 18, 2017 at 12:44 PM
I actually watch the cartoon version immediately after I watch this live version. And I preferred the live version. I just find it more holistic. I feel it has more depth now. Like the father is improved. And I like the teapot so much better. And I like the new candlestick.
I just love the new look better! And all the back stories they added.
It feels more magical for me, this life version.
Reply by tmdb38541732
on March 18, 2017 at 12:45 PM
Absurd. Period.
Reply by QueenFanUS
on March 18, 2017 at 12:49 PM
Interesting. I do see what you're saying. I don't know if I'm ready to say that this live action version is "better" than the animated version. I don't even know if I like it as much. I will need a few more views over time to see just how it ranks...it's still too new.
I will say that I loved it, though!
Reply by condemned02
on March 18, 2017 at 12:54 PM
I think also they took out all the music I didn't like in the cartoon version. And added new music which was all great!
I love the new song Evermore, where the Beast sang it after Belle left!
I love the part where they bonded more, where Beast took her to Paris.
It just added alot more to it!
The live action one touched me more.
Reply by lantzn
on March 18, 2017 at 6:27 PM
Paris! What? He's a cursed person hiding away from the world, how does going to Paris fit in with that? Paris would crucify a monster.
Reply by condemned02
on March 18, 2017 at 11:00 PM
Paris was Belle birth place, and Belle wanted to know what happened to her mother as her dad refused to tell her, so Beast made that happen for her. It was just another great scene to see them bonding as a couple.
Reply by dannyjobee
on March 18, 2017 at 11:36 PM
I am a huge fan of the original. It is truly a timeless piece of art, the first film I ever saw at the cinema aged 6 and nothing will ever replace the value I have for that movie.
I would like to say that you really can not show more adulation than that. I am not however closed minded and I am very proud of that fact.
This live action film very obviously sparked my interest from the get go. I was appalled by my experience of Disney's live action butchering of my childhood favourites I'd seen up till this point.
Alice in Wonderland was my first brush, everything was there and it just turned out to be so far removed and trash I was quite bitter. Then Maleficent came out the all time greatest villain for me and Angelina Jolie was an inspired piece of casting, this became the only good part of the film everything else was absolutely infuriating to me she was pure evil keep her that way, that is why the opening party scene in live action was the only good part of the totally piece of trash film.
When BATB live was announced I was like no, just no. What are they going to 'rework' and mutilate this time. Then more and more details were released trailers etc, slowly but surely I was really looking forward to it, they were going to do a faithful adaptation of their animated masterpiece, finally a live action version that the people want.
And you know what I absolutely love it, it is just excellent, a little slower at the start, but so much richer, real effort has been made. they could not have made it like for like as what works in animation just wouldn't in live action, but this film just doesn't miss a beat and it got me to care again for every character in new and fresh ways.
Everyone is a critic these days and I am a little tired of the cynicism, I consider myself a reasonably intelligent person with a strong and vested interest in film. I understand what makes a masterpiece just that, the original is a masterpiece and while this film doesn't quite achieve those height it is an excellent homage with a little extra, that even might enhance the animated version on future viewings, there is certainly a place for it.
So the cynical critics and the stagnant close minded hangers on of the past really missed out here, shame for them really. I already have my next ticket booked on Monday :)
Reply by tuklat
on March 18, 2017 at 11:36 PM
Honestly, even though you seem to have made up your mind already and you probably won't see it, you should. It doesn't take away from the animated version at all. I love the original, it's by far my favorite Disney film and in my top 5 favorite films of all time...I love it that much and as excited as I was to see this movie, I was also almost 100% certain I was going to be disappointed, but I wasn't at all. You should really give it a chance. Don't listen to the people saying it's a shot for shot remake...other than the musical numbers and a few key scenes, they actually changed/added a lot more than I was expecting. It's really a beautiful movie to watch regardless. I feel like there are a lot of things I liked better in this one and few things I didn't and as a result I feel like both movies are on par. I don't feel like one or the other is better. The live action is almost more of an extension.
Pros:
-The beautiful sets and the overall look and feel of the movie was truly breathtaking. They spared no expense when it came to detail. -I love all the added scenes with Belle and the Beast. I feel like it made more sense why she feel in love with him. In the animated, he saves her from the wolves and then like 1 scene later she's falling in love with him. It seemed a bit rushed, which worked fine in animated form, but for live action I think it needed to be expanded on. -Maurice is a vast improvement in this version. -The ending where the characters are all turning inanimate was a brilliant. I actually got teary-eyed. -They address some of the plot holes of the original. I especially liked that they explained how there was a giant castle not far from their town and no one seemed to know about it. -I liked the scene where all the loved ones came back. It was sweet. -Beast's and Philippe's 2 second moment in Something There. I don't know why but that little scene made my week lol -The minister was a small role, but I really liked him. -The Gaston song was really well done. -I like that the enchantress was keeping an eye on everything the whole movie. That was a neat addition. -The scene when Maurice arrives at the castle to when he gets taken by the beast was was better. -The Beast letting Belle say goodbye.
Cons:
-The singing wasn't as good as the original. Josh Gad and Audra McDonald were fantastic and I thought Luke Evans, Emma Thompson, Ewan McGregor, and Dan Stevens held there own very well, but Emma was a bit underwhelming, but I also I think what she lacked in singing ability she made up for in the acting department. I thought she did great. Way better than what I expected.
Neutral observations:
-It was interesting how they chose to portray the Beast in this version. In the original he's more hopeful when Belle gets there and even though he doesn't think he stands a chance, he's willing to try.. In this version, he's almost more defeated. He's given up all hope, so when Belle first arrives he doesn't really seem to care. He doesn't even entertain the idea that she could break the spell because he's already convinced it's never going to happen. He even seems to resist his feelings at first. He definitely needed more prodding from the staff to make an effort. It was a different take and I like both interpretations.
-Gaston's character arc was surprising. Even though I wish he was more of a jerk at the beginning so it made more sense that Belle would hate him, overall I thought it was also an interesting choice to have his evil side almost sneak up on you. It was almost like Belle's rejection caused him to have a psychotic break. He gave major ex-boyfriend-who-would-rather-kill-his-girlfriend-than-let-her-be-with-anyone-else vibes. He was definitely a little more on the evil side in this one. The version in the original worked for a cartoon, but this version worked just as well for a live-action adaptation. -I liked Lefou, but I thought his redemption arc was a little rushed. -I feel like the Days In the Sun number could have been taken out and then used to time to flesh out some of the other scenes.
All in all some things were better, some not, and some just different. It's definitely worth the ticket price in my opinion.
Reply by blacknyellowsquid
on March 18, 2017 at 11:45 PM
I'm glad you got something out of my rambling thoughts. It's clear to me that the original Beauty and the Beast is very near and dear and sacred to you, but who knows, maybe you'll like something about the new one if you go to see it. While B&B is prolly my favorite Disney movie, it was never an obsession of mine (like some other stories...and I go hard when I get "into" something)....so for me, for this, I was more open and flexible to changes. I guess my point is...if you really love the original, I can see why you wouldn't want something messing with that. But I don't know, I feel this one was different enough that it doesn't obliterate or ruin the old one. They both can stand separately/independently, if that makes sense. So see it, hate it, ignore it, move on. (Well do what you want!) Or maybe they'll be something you like about it, who knows?
Yes definitely I think it works better in animation because talking objects and taking a beast seriously as a "love interest" work better when ALL the characters are animated, including the humans. So they're all the same medium/world/plane of existence. Whereas in this version, it's like "yay scenes with real humans...and oh...now back to this weird CGI stuff...hmm...."
Like I mentioned, I missed the ol' Cogsworth because he was my favorite. The clock here in the live version was actually kind of cute (?) but he was just stodgy and they kept emphasizing how cowardly he was, too. Lumiere and Cogsworth had such chemistry in the original...a love hate kind of friendship, butting heads and not seeing eye-to-eye, but at the end of the day they cared about each other and helped each other out (like when Cogsworth saves him at the end fight). I didn't get much of any of that in this movie. Cogsworth was a (somewhat cute) pill and Lumiere was just kinda obnoxious.
However the Beast, besides his distracting CGI...I will say, I actually thought he was well "acted" (if you can call it that) in the live action version. He seemed more believable as a cursed human being maybe even moreso than the one in the cartoon. In the cartoon it was like Beast vs Prince...I was always a little confused that the prince was underneath the Beast with the way he acted lol. It was more like a beast/animal that turns into a human, almost like two different characters (although perhaps that's more faithful to the fairy tale?). But this, he still seemed human on the inside ....and they did seem to emphasize the curse part, and his loneliness and depression, which I kinda liked, TBH. Like he knew he was stuck and was sad and rather hopeless, regretful, whatnot. That helped build sympathy for him too, basically he was just as much a prisoner as she was in some ways....though it wasn't fair to keep her there, either, etc. So yeah. But I just wish they had used real prosthetics instead of CGI with him ...made it harder to connect.
And yeah, they way they changed Gaston was hard to wrap my head around. As far as why Maurice and Belle were so against him even before his true darker/bad colors began to show. Like, LeFou seemed to know (maybe from some prior experience?) that he had the potential to be bad underneath, but to everyone else he seemed pretty cool. Unlike the cartoon....he was almost a different character to me.
Lastly, I don't mind the LeFou changes. I liked them. They made him a "round" character here, with an arc, maybe just bc they wanted to give Jake Gad a more interesting part. But I liked it, I was fine with it, even if it did differ from the original. LeFou was just one-note there in the animated version....he was Gaston's lil bitch and took the abuse that came with that just for the honor of getting to BE his right hand lil bitch. No, I didn't get gay undertones from the original. But again, me personally, I was fine that they added more dimension to LeFou. I liked that little subplot. LeFou wasn't an important character anyway, so it wasn't a problem to flesh him out some, I don't think. And as for his secret (or not so secret...lol cmon Gaston had to know!) crushing on Gaston the whole time...I like that kind of crap. I am a sucker for unrequited love/infatuation type of deals. But there really wasn't a ton of screentime devoted to this ... I wish there had been more. ;)
kthxb. I think maybe you should see it, because you might like _some_thing in it. And if not, well, just obliterate it out of your mind by rewatching the original lol